Rank insignia
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Rank insignia
Dear all,
I just wonder was there any rank insignia difference between Colonel-in-chief, Colonel-en-Second, Colonel Commandant, Colonel-on-the-staff and Colonel in between 1810 and 1855?
Sharing views, image, book references and articles are highly appreciated.
Regards
Shams
I just wonder was there any rank insignia difference between Colonel-in-chief, Colonel-en-Second, Colonel Commandant, Colonel-on-the-staff and Colonel in between 1810 and 1855?
Sharing views, image, book references and articles are highly appreciated.
Regards
Shams
sbintayab- Posts : 137
Join date : 2010-12-29
Age : 40
Location : Clayton, Victoria, Australia
Re: Rank insignia
Shams, they are not strictly ranks but rather appointments.
Commander in Chief is the title given in time of war to the officer in over-all command of the forces in the field or theatre.
A regiment is honoured by having a member of the Royal Family appointed as their Colonel in Chief. The Queen is the Colonel in Chief of the Household the Cavalry.
Colonel Commandant is an Honorary appointment in recognition of their service.
Rank of Commandant in the Indian Regiments was equivalent to Lt. Colonel.
The title Commandant was given to officer in charge of Schools of Gunnery, Military Engineering, Musketry, Music the R. M. Asylum and the Staff College regardless of their actual rank. Also, the Commandant of the R. M. college was was directly under the Governor.
Commander Household Cavalry is another appointment.
Colonel-on-the-Staff as far as I know was just referred to in dress regulations to show that he was on the Staff and not an appointment or special rank.
Not sure what you want to know regarding the rank of Colonel between 1810 and 1855 other than what's been posted.
Commander in Chief is the title given in time of war to the officer in over-all command of the forces in the field or theatre.
A regiment is honoured by having a member of the Royal Family appointed as their Colonel in Chief. The Queen is the Colonel in Chief of the Household the Cavalry.
Colonel Commandant is an Honorary appointment in recognition of their service.
Rank of Commandant in the Indian Regiments was equivalent to Lt. Colonel.
The title Commandant was given to officer in charge of Schools of Gunnery, Military Engineering, Musketry, Music the R. M. Asylum and the Staff College regardless of their actual rank. Also, the Commandant of the R. M. college was was directly under the Governor.
Commander Household Cavalry is another appointment.
Colonel-on-the-Staff as far as I know was just referred to in dress regulations to show that he was on the Staff and not an appointment or special rank.
Not sure what you want to know regarding the rank of Colonel between 1810 and 1855 other than what's been posted.
wfrad- Posts : 16416
Join date : 2008-04-16
Location : Durham UK
Re: Rank insignia
Shams,
The British Army by Talbot Booth mentions some military appointments and the 1916 pamphlet 'Badges and their Meaning' published by George Philip & Son has a few illustrations of staff and department uniforms.
Here's some pages from Badges and their Meaning, if you don't have a copy it's quite easy to find one to download.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
The British Army by Talbot Booth mentions some military appointments and the 1916 pamphlet 'Badges and their Meaning' published by George Philip & Son has a few illustrations of staff and department uniforms.
Here's some pages from Badges and their Meaning, if you don't have a copy it's quite easy to find one to download.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
wfrad- Posts : 16416
Join date : 2008-04-16
Location : Durham UK
Re: Rank insignia
Hi wfrad
Thanks for the message. I have this book. This book is the first book where I got to know that over the period the rank badges of the British army were not same. Then I started digging up to trace the history of the rank badges of the British army. Recently I have found that prior to the Napoleonic war, regiments were commanders rank was Colonel-in-chief or Colonel Commandant. That's why I thought there should be some distinction between such ranks. Such ranked officers used same rank insignias of Colonel as per the Dawnay's book. Life is really strange. I like history, but doing research in the Cancer Genome. Hope I will get time to complete my incomplete project of the development/ evolution of rank badges of the British army officers.
Regards
Shams
Thanks for the message. I have this book. This book is the first book where I got to know that over the period the rank badges of the British army were not same. Then I started digging up to trace the history of the rank badges of the British army. Recently I have found that prior to the Napoleonic war, regiments were commanders rank was Colonel-in-chief or Colonel Commandant. That's why I thought there should be some distinction between such ranks. Such ranked officers used same rank insignias of Colonel as per the Dawnay's book. Life is really strange. I like history, but doing research in the Cancer Genome. Hope I will get time to complete my incomplete project of the development/ evolution of rank badges of the British army officers.
Regards
Shams
sbintayab- Posts : 137
Join date : 2010-12-29
Age : 40
Location : Clayton, Victoria, Australia
Re: Rank insignia
Shams,
Not many books on uniforms go into any great detail regarding rank badges before the Napoleonic period, probably because it wasn't well documented and up to interpretation.
As you probably know the first real effort to regulate offices uniforms wasn't until the 1810 warrant.
As far as I know, which isn't much, before that date it was mainly left upon the Colonel's whims, and what the officers could afford leaving many looking like a refugee form the Gilbert & Sullivan's opera H.M.S. Pinafore.
More elaborate coats would distinguish the field officer from the company officer and individual rank was shown by sash, gorget and weapon.
In 1685 captains gorgets were silver plate double gilt, lieutenants gorgets polished steel {black} with nails of gold while ensigns gorgets were silver plate.
The 1768 warrant was the first official regulations to distinguish officers rank and used epaulettes to do so.
Prior to 1810 the dress code was flexible to say the least, so maybe someone with some more helpful information will let us know
Regards
Wilf
Not many books on uniforms go into any great detail regarding rank badges before the Napoleonic period, probably because it wasn't well documented and up to interpretation.
As you probably know the first real effort to regulate offices uniforms wasn't until the 1810 warrant.
As far as I know, which isn't much, before that date it was mainly left upon the Colonel's whims, and what the officers could afford leaving many looking like a refugee form the Gilbert & Sullivan's opera H.M.S. Pinafore.
More elaborate coats would distinguish the field officer from the company officer and individual rank was shown by sash, gorget and weapon.
In 1685 captains gorgets were silver plate double gilt, lieutenants gorgets polished steel {black} with nails of gold while ensigns gorgets were silver plate.
The 1768 warrant was the first official regulations to distinguish officers rank and used epaulettes to do so.
Prior to 1810 the dress code was flexible to say the least, so maybe someone with some more helpful information will let us know
Regards
Wilf
wfrad- Posts : 16416
Join date : 2008-04-16
Location : Durham UK
Foot Guards officer rank badges
Gentlemen,
I would like to know when the officers of Foot Guards regiments adopted for their rank badges the Star of the Garter (GG, CG) and that of the Order of the Thistle (SG).
Do you know if Household Cavalry regiments also had adopted the star of the Order of the Garter? and if yes, when?
Thank you very much in advance
Pedro
I would like to know when the officers of Foot Guards regiments adopted for their rank badges the Star of the Garter (GG, CG) and that of the Order of the Thistle (SG).
Do you know if Household Cavalry regiments also had adopted the star of the Order of the Garter? and if yes, when?
Thank you very much in advance
Pedro
pedroalfonso- Posts : 55
Join date : 2009-09-21
Re: Rank insignia
During the 19th century it seemed like they wore what they fancied. A General Order of 1830 stated that the star on officers epaulettes was to be the Order of Bath, except for those regiment had prior authorization for the National Badge,
The Irish Guards when formed in 1900, for a short time wore the Order of Bath, the star changed to St Patrick shortly after WWI.
The Welsh Guards took an elongated version of the Garter Star, and the Scots Guards the Order of the Thistle.
The Irish Guards when formed in 1900, for a short time wore the Order of Bath, the star changed to St Patrick shortly after WWI.
The Welsh Guards took an elongated version of the Garter Star, and the Scots Guards the Order of the Thistle.
wfrad- Posts : 16416
Join date : 2008-04-16
Location : Durham UK
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